Growing, Scaling, and Hiring a Team

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Starting and scaling a team of employees is one of the most intimidating aspects of owning your own business — but it doesn’t have to be. Ashley Ebert joins us in this episode to cover how to get started building a team, top tricks and tips, and get in the right mindset to lead a team with success.

Ashley Ebert is the co-founder of The Abundance Group, a coaching membership for wedding professionals that helps build strategy into business without the stress. She also founded The Simply Elegant Group, a wedding planning company with branches nationwide.

The Abundance Group // Instagram // The Simply Elegant Group // Instagram

The episode:

Katrina Widener: Hello everyone! Today, I'm here with Ashley Ebert and I'm really excited to have her. We're going to be talking about all things scaling your business and knowing when it's the right time to hire and really just growing your businesses, which is perfect because Ashley has done that with both of her businesses. If you don't know Ashley, she is the founder of Simply Elegant and the co-founder of The Abundance Group. So thank you so much, Ashley, for being on the podcast today.

Ashley Ebert: Well, thanks for having me. I'm so excited to talk to you and I get to see you, although all the other podcasters can't. I get to.

Katrina Widener: Which is the bonus of being the podcast host actually. Do you want to really quickly just introduce yourself so everybody can get an idea of who you are and..."

Ashley Ebert: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, for those that aren't familiar with my work, um, I actually own two businesses as Katrina mentioned, one is a wedding planning company. We actually have nine locations and a team of 40. So it's actually one of the largest in the country. And from that it's phenomenal how self-sustaining it is. But I'm also a workhorse. I love work. I enjoy work. I get value and meaning from my work. So I kinda got bored cause the girls know how to plan. They plan well, they're efficient. It's incredible. So I started a second business with my dad called The Abundance Group, where we teach small business owners and specifically wedding professionals how to grow and scale their businesses. It's been so much fun.

A trying year for both businesses in 2020. So it's definitely different than we expected, but another just beautiful connection with our community and getting them through the last 12, 12 to 18 months has been fun.

Katrina Widener: Yeah, definitely. This is why you are the perfect person to have on and come talk about this, which I was so excited when you suggested it because you know what you're talking about. You are definitely someone who has been able to do it on your own with your businesses, but like you said, like 2020 hit everybody hard, especially the wedding industry, which is really who you cater to, so.

Ashley Ebert: Well, it's funny, like I said, both businesses were affected, usually when you have multiple businesses, they don't necessarily have as big of an impact on things like that.

But yeah, it was a crazy year and honestly, cause entrepreneurs work so hard. They drive themselves into the ground sometimes, and it is terrifying how quickly that can go with circumstances, like what we've just been through. And how do we prevent that from happening and how do we build businesses that are really able to give us that sustainability? And that's just such a passion of Dad and mine and a lot of what we're doing at The Abundance Group.

Katrina Widener: You're like talking about it, I'm like, "Ooh, this feels so good." Cause it's, that's so very important. And I think that's something that all entrepreneurs are really looking for and really want is that sort of a business. So anyway, I'm we can go off on probably 800 tangents while we're here.

Ashley Ebert: We sure could. And we probably have in our life together.

Katrina Widener: Oh I'm sure. But the first thing that I really wanted to touch on is this idea of knowing when it's the right time to scale your business and knowing when it's the right time, whether that's hiring on new people or really delegating out to whether it's a VA or employees or whatever it might be. So I was wondering if you could share a little bit about just how to know, even.

Ashley Ebert: Yeah, it's a great question. And it's one, a lot of people struggle with. The thing for me is we give all of this effort and time and sometimes financial resources and all of what we have to our businesses. But at the end of the day, they need to work for us.

They need to be building the lifestyle that we want. And yes, that can mean financially that we have the material things and the opportunity, but even more so for me is the time. I want to make sure that I have a three-year-old daughter who is my whole world. And I want to make sure I have time with her when I want my husband.

It's you know, 1:00 PM when we're recording this, my husband and I have a date day plan. We have a sitter coming over at three, I want to be done with work. I'm gonna go hang with him. That's the lifestyle I want. I want to be able to seamlessly move between work and play. And I want to play a lot. I love work, but I want to enjoy my life.

And for me, it's really about, whether you have an annual practice of setting goals or quarterly, whatever that looks like, let's not focus on necessarily the profit. I'm going to bring home. Let's focus on the life I want to live. That's a really great place to start, because if you are working more.

Then you care too, and you're making enough money to sustain the lifestyle that can usually be a great time to go. What can I outsource? What can I give away for someone else to do to give me more balance back in my life and have more playtime as I like to say more playtime. That's a really great thing, but I will say the number one struggle. The next biggest question, which I think is even more important that we hit a lot is how do I trust someone else to come into my brand and really show up? Because it's terrifying. Like I've taken all the time to build my rapport with my clients, to build my social media, to like craft this experience that other people receive when they learn about me or they work with me or whatever, and that's the number one mindset hurdle that we. All have, and we all experience in different ways.

For me, I am definitely I'm not risk averse. I'm like, let's do it. We'll figure it out on the way there. Let's all, problem solve. It's fine. Like it's gonna be great, but there are a lot of other business owners we work with where they really need that control and they want to make sure that everything is done the way that they want. And that's great, neither are wrong, or right. They're just different. And taking inventory of that is really important. So knowing where you fall on that scale, but then understanding trust is built over time with your team. That happens. But there are certain things I always say, there's three questions to ask yourself from a mindset perspective to get you over this hurdle.

The first one is, "Do you love your business?" The answer is probably yes, because you wouldn't work so hard and you probably wouldn't wanna be building a team if you're like, nah, I'm going to do the corporate thing cause it's not my fave. So do you love your business? The answer is probably yes. "Do you work hard in your business?" is the second one. Again, most entrepreneurs I have met it's a heck yes. And the third and final question is, " Do you have a great rapport with your clients?" Again, usually it's a yes. If you have a thriving, successful business, you probably are treating your clients well.

If you have a yes, to all those questions, the aha moment here is you can probably outwork any mistakes a team member might make because shocker: you're probably gonna hire a human being that is imperfect and probably will make a mistake as you probably have in your business.

And dad and I always preach. You're not a boss, you're a coach. You need to coach them to thrive in your business. That is a whole different hat that you're wearing and it creates such better team culture. But really it's a person and you know there are going to be things that happen. So that for me, I think is, yes. How do I know when I wanna build a team? I think the answer is cause you're burned out and you're making enough money to afford somebody else.

You can get into the fiscal reasons, all of that. And I'm sure you have an expert that can tell you all about that, but there is a time when you can afford people to come in and help you, or can you free up more time to, to have revenue driving tasks? And that's a great investment. So that kind of checks that box, but really the bigger issue, oftentimes when we peel back the layer is the mindset.

And when you can get over that hurdle and realize that you love your job, you're willing to work hard at it, and you treat your clients well. I have had I've had a team for, Oh man, probably seven or eight years. There has never been an issue. Never. And we do hundreds and hundreds of weddings in a typical year.

There's never been an issue I couldn't outwork to make the client feel better to again, make sure that we're working together to find a solution. My business has never crumbled because of a mistake somebody else made. I'm still here. And I think it's a really big kind of aha moment.

Katrina Widener: I'm just like, you know me and anyone listening to this podcast who knows me about the idea that like we do want to start from that sort of holistic lens of what are the things that I want, what are the goals that I want? And also honestly, like, how am I standing in my own way? How am I being the person that is stopping me from getting to where I want to go?

And that can really be that mindset part. I yeah. If I could snap -- a little known fact, I can't snap my fingers -- but if I could snap my fingers. Yes. All of the snaps for you. Okay. So when people have gotten into this decision that they are ready to move forward and are like: "You know what? I've answered yes to all the questions, I am at the place where I've like got my mindset in the right place to grow my team and scale my business," what would you say would be like the first steps that they need to take or like the things that maybe you'd be like, Oh my gosh, I didn't even think that I needed to start doing this when I wanted to learn.

Ashley Ebert: Yeah. There's this , you know, a lot of people, if they're in this space or I've heard coaching or training around this, it's this idea of creating like a list of things I love to do and a list of things I don't love to do. It's a great place to start, but it's missing something really big because a lot of times people will say "Oh, I love to take care of my clients. I love to" (I work with a lot of wedding pros obviously), "I love to design the floral. I love to create the mood boards. I don't want to deal with the mother-in-laws or whatever." You have this, like this list. I love the list I don't love. Great task to start like great, tangible, tactical way that you could get moving and get inspired about how to move forward, because any action is better than no action, period.

But it's missing the thing that I think a lot of people overlook in that we want to make sure that we keep the revenue generating tasks close to the vest. Like we want to make sure that we are still in control of those, because that is lifeblood to our business. And sometimes, I have a lot of people that ask me questions of "I'm not the greatest at sales or I don't feel confident. I don't love that part of the business. I don't love to sell." And a lot of creative entrepreneurs, like we want to create, we don't necessarily want to sell. I definitely caution people to give sales away because if some, if you put someone in that seat that is not as good as you. You will quickly see the negative side effects.

So we want it, pros and cons list is fantastic or kind of loves and don't loves lists is great. You can definitely do that, but also just be mindful of where those revenue generating tasks land. They need to stay on your plate until you have matured enough in your business where maybe you have salaried professionals.

You're doing a much more sophisticated onboarding process. You're tracking your metrics in a really intentional way, because then you can see if sales are dropping, you can see if their sales are dropping quickly and then you can make changes and alter that. So like right now, for me, like I don't do sales in my business.

But it was definitely something I gave away last because that was the thing that I needed to protect in my business. So I love that. I love that concept to do the things I love things I don't, but then just make sure that highlighter comes out of these are the things that make me money.

And we just need to be mindful of where those land and I always recommend that they stay on your plate until you've really matured to have someone, and honestly can compensate someone in a sales position or something like that would allow you to move away from those types of tasks.

Katrina Widener: I think that's super important. And honestly, not something that a lot of people would think about, which is why it's perfect for the podcast, because it's very much " Hey, remember that the things that are getting you money, like you want to connect to your ideal client and you want to make sure that you're speaking to them in a way that they understand. So that seems like 100% makes sense.

Ashley Ebert: And I think it's not super an intentional thing that people do. They do the two lists and it's I'm in this place where I just want to get the stuff off my list I don't like. And heck yeah, let's do that. You've worked hard and you've earned that, but let's just also make sure we have a really thriving business in a year, two years, three years. So we're just being really intentional about that.

Katrina Widener: So I have another quick question. I have heard a lot of times, and I'm very curious of your opinion on this of people saying, "Okay, when you're ready to hire someone, make sure that you already have the systems in place, or you have like actually sat down and written out exactly your processes for how you do every single thing, which...

Ashley Ebert: Write those SOPS, yes!

Katrina Widener: ...I'm like, it makes so much sense to me, but I have heard people being like "I'll figure that out when I get someone" or those sorts of things. So what would you say to someone who's kind of like, "Is that really that necessary?"

Ashley Ebert: That's a great question. And here's my answer. It's complicated. It depends on where you're at in your business has all lawyers and whatever say it depends on your situation. I think if you are completely drowning and you need someone, you're not going to have the time to go back and write a twenty page SOP, you just, you don't have the time to do that.

And I don't think that you're just out of luck, I think that's a situation where it's not ideal. Like we always try to coach let's hire before we get there, because you can be more intentional and intentionality is always a good thing. But sometimes life, or sometimes you have a crazy successful year or season, or man, you came out of the gate and it was awesome.

And those are great things. You don't penalize them or say that was wrong. Really, I think what the thing is it's about the expectations and the communication that you have with the team member that you onboard. So if you are hiring someone and you have all those SOPs in place, great, they know they're going to walk into a more rigorous training program.

Like at Simply Elegant we have a 40 hour training program. There's three levels of assessment you take, like it's very structured. Now we're 11 years in, nine branches, right? That didn't pop up overnight. We built that over time, but if you're a newer business and you haven't had the time or the ability to write that out, you just need to be really upfront about that.

We're going to build this out together. It's totally okay. And I think the other thing that is so, so helpful is like recording Loom videos or Zoom videos about how you're doing something screen-sharing because typically you're hiring someone for something that you're already doing, especially if you're thinking like your first hire is usually like an admin, a social media manager, or something like that, you're probably already doing those tasks.

So how can you do them? You maybe have them watch you do them, but then also record that so they can come back and watch it later. So you're not having to spend your time going over the same thing over and over again. So that's key. I think video is great. You can also have written documentation.

You just have to decide which one you want to do or how your organization does that. I think some Some ability to have both is great, because then now you're, thinking like a coach, right? As a leader. You're giving way for the learning style of the other person that's a part of the training. So if they learn better via video or voice, that's great or if they learn better via reading, that's great too. And you have that.

Katrina Widener: I really appreciate that also because like for me, always coming from an accessibility standpoint too, like having the different options, like you're saying, meeting people where they are, it's super, super important. And I had actually never thought about doing like a Loom video beforehand, but it makes so much sense. Hey, I'm doing it anyway. Why don't I just record myself and make everything so much easier?

Ashley Ebert: And I'm always trying to buy people's time back. That's the thing for me. And here's, the real issue with standard operating procedures, SOPs, like you talked about or any training program, it takes time and you want to do it well, because you want to train your people well. To trust them, you have to equip them. You can't just be like, go and do it exactly how I want. We all know, like reasonably doesn't make sense. But for us, like I think the thing is taking the time to do training. It takes, it does, it just takes time. But I think when we wrap our minds around it as investment. For every hour I'm spending here, I'm getting a hundred back over the next year. Yeah. Sign me up for a one to a hundred ROI. The ROI on our time is incredible.

Katrina Widener: 100% that makes so so much sense. And I think it really breaks down in a way that's super easy for people. Okay. So just to finish things off, what would you say is like the number one tip that you would give someone who's considering scaling their team? Like right now, like the number one thing I would say to do is...

Ashley Ebert: Do it. Build your team. And obviously like I have a lens and I have a amazing lifestyle because of it. My husband and I don't live large, but he doesn't work. He stays at home with my daughter full time and gets to be in those moments and I get to ebb and flow from work to life. And, like it's incredible, and the thing that, dad and I talk about the realization of this is pretty simple.

The first thing is, if you work a corporate job, the corporation or the other employer owns your job. When you work for yourself as a solopreneur, you own your job, but it's still a job. When you build a team, you're building a business asset and it's now the first time you don't have to trade time for money.

Right? If you're a planner and you own your own planning company, if you're a planner for a corporate, they own your jobs, they tell you when they tell you how that's great. Some people love that and that's great. When people are solopreneurs really then they get to say what clients are going to take, how much you're going to charge, they're in control. But at the end of the day, you still got to execute the weddings. You still got to show up. When you build a team that can now learn your brand, know your style, all of this.

And I think a hesitation for a lot of people is "Well I'm just a creative or how do I explain how I build this floral design or a mood board?" The creative side is so hard to articulate and I would venture to guess that you haven't actually tried to articulate it because when you get down to it and you start writing things out about your process, you will start to realize there's some similarities in how you do things over time that you can teach. So even in in the creative world. You can do that. But like I say, I think the thing is, my biggest piece of advice is do it. I think everyone should have a business asset and people are so afraid and I've close friends of both of ours that are, that have said to me, "Ashley, I'm so afraid of being a boss."

I don't want to lead a team. And for me, it's like you get to coach and watch people grow into these beautiful positions in humans. And what an a what, a more amazing, I've never had one in my career than watching my simply elegant team be empowered and love their work. And like I said there's nothing better and everyone can be a great leader.

It's a skill. It is not a personality you are born with. There's a lot of mindset stuff around building your team. If you really want, I think that "life" a lot of people think about where you have complete freedom, you make the money you want, you can travel, you can do whatever you really need to take inventory of if that's ever even possible if you don't build a team. Because you will just still you own your job, but you will still have a job. And there were seasons in my life where like, when I had my daughter, I took four months off period, and it was amazing. And I still made my salary.

You know what I mean? And there's obviously things you do to set up success like that, but like in what other world could you have done that? Unless I had a team behind me, I just couldn't have, and their support allowed me to have the lifestyle I wanted.

If everyone has not realized I'm a big advocate for teams. And I think that they are the most incredible thing you can do for yourself and your business. But yeah, like I say, I think if you're debating about it, it probably means you should do it.

Katrina Widener: Yes. Okay. Thank you so much, Ashley, for coming on here. I'm like, I know that people have follow-up questions or maybe want to get into your realm. So where can they find you after the podcast is over?

Ashley Ebert: Yeah. Two places: I'm pretty active on Instagram. We're just @theabundancegroup and I'm actually super active in Clubhouse. I love Clubhouse in that I get to have conversations with people. So that's a a medium you use or you love, that's a great place to find me and I'm just Ashley Ebert over there.

Katrina Widener: Perfect. Thank you so much for coming. This has been absolutely amazing.

Ashley Ebert: Yeah. And if we got to do another podcast, I'm in.

Katrina Widener: Perfect. Stay tuned for part two.

Ashley Ebert: I love it.